Commissioner Meeting Transcript 12/20/2023
On Jan 20, 2023 the Jefferson County Public Hospital District #2 board of commissioners met at an offsite location in Port Ludlow for an open public meeting and retreat.
Commissioner Matt Ready 2:29:36
“It could be considered fraud. It’s just not you know, it’s just like pointless fraud because fraud would involve some sort of financial benefit or something. But this was just, this was just sort of like a deception for, i dont know, for because people disagreed on something, “
40 Minutes Earlier in This Conversation
Commissioner Kolff 1:49:24
All right, I have grown to appreciate who you are. And I’ve actually grown accustomed to your snarkiness. However, it’s
Commissioner Dressler 1:49:34
not really snark, however,
Commissioner Kolff 1:49:36
and I can I enjoy a banter. But this is really allowing me to think about so what does somebody who’s listening to our conversation? What did they say? Okay, so you make a snarky comment, like, which basically says, I think you’re asking too many questions. So now you have actually, quote, criticized me in public. And somebody then says, oh, maybe case does talk too much in public. And it’s interesting, because this is the first time you’re asking this question. This is the first time that I’ve tried to take a look at that relationship that we have, from the outside at this point that we’ve been looking at. It’s between you and me. Yeah, it’s just this personal thing. But it is a public thing. And so I’m beginning to think that maybe that isn’t doing the organization. And,
Commissioner Dressler 1:50:37
yes, but and without wanting to, say, get into too much of this conversation with Well, you did this and you did that is particularly a letter to the leader in the fall, where case has rights for frequently to the auditor at that time quite frequently to believe. And at one letter in particular, that on this level, in particular, I’m not necessarily read them all, but said that it always says at the end, I’m speaking for myself. But I feel that the rest of the members of my board agree with me. And I find that irritating? Because you don’t know, nobody knows, Joe doesn’t know Bruce doesn’t know if I agree with that or not. So I find that quite irritating. So that’s part of,
Consultant Karma B 1:51:35
well, that’s a separate issue that they can address. Yes, we can ask him, please don’t put that in your letter.
Commissioner Dressler 1:51:41
And so So I think those sorts of things undermine our relationship, my relationship?
Consultant Karma B 1:51:48
Well, you’ve got lots of evidence for it. I’m not saying you’re wrong. Bruce, you had something to say?
Commissioner McComas 1:51:53
Well, I think that smile and personal feeling, I think that once we get back to having in person meetings will help. Yeah, I couldn’t keep my table. Right. But I mean, or when we take a break, I get asked Caeser question. What did you really mean by that, rather than being in public? And get, you know, a better understanding? And not make an assumption?
Consultant Karma B 1:52:22
I think most everyone has been contributing. Matt, you don’t need to. But did you have anything you wanted to weigh in on here?
Commissioner Ready 1:52:36
Well, I mean, I mean, as everyone knows. There’s a single conflict, that’s sort of related to the recording issue that really distracted me for seven years. And it’s really unfortunate, it took that long to get it resolved. It’s I reflect back on if it had been handled differently, or just somehow more quickly, so we had gotten to where we, we got at the end of last year, where we, we drafted? We got that, that legal opinion. And we we drafted board policy on it. I mean, that it just happened five years earlier, when we had when the hospital had received the opinion, then I mean, it just I just reflect back on how different everything would be now. I mean, it’s just the whole process was draining and and yes, obviously affected trust. I like I felt like somebody or some group of people decided to hide a legal opinion from me for five years. And it didn’t come out until the board voted to hire an outside party. And it was finally given to the board. That’s I mean, that’s that’s a pretty significant deception of the board or Pretty incompetent. so anyways so yeah, that was the big thing that really broke my trust. And I also, I think, I realized one of my, my bigger problems is, is that it’s not it wasn’t explained at all. Why did that happen? I was just sort of told. Here’s the opinion I’ll just like that we’ll just move on. I was given no explanation, no credible, no credible explanation. Literally, we were told Jill found the opinion on her desk. That was literally said. (That was) the most ridiculous explanation for a legal opinion getting to the board. Jill (Jill Buhler the board chair) found it on her desk. So anyways, I, you know, I gave Mike a poor review last year, because of that whole debacle taking seven years, I gave him a negative review. And in an executive session, I said, “I’m disappointed.” And there was an opportunity for you guys to explain what happened and why it happened. Nobody gave me any explanation. So I just said, Look, I’m disappointed and I want to move on. And so I thought we could, you know, I mean, I was kind of hoping, okay, maybe that’s it, maybe we move on. But then, you know, then the board, you guys get together in an Executive Session, like the following week, and suddenly, you guys all are attacking me for giving him a low review? Because this legal opinion was not given to the board for five years. And then, and some of you like, we’re like, like, Bruce suddenly was saying, Oh, if you didn’t need the opinion, you were told all this. Like, as if you knew what had been going on for seven years, it was just like, it was anyways, it was very traumatic draining process. And but the bizarre thing is, it’s just one issue. Like if somehow we can separate it, that the recording issue, and all the everything that happened around that, like every other aspect of hospital care and management and everything, is was in a completely different ballpark. It is just so sad that this one issue that really was just a simple legal issue that could have been resolved quickly had to stretch out so long and be mishandled so badly. I mean, it’s, it’s just, it’s really,… just like sad, because it’s like, it’s destroyed… Our management system destroyed… it’s created a really awkward, weird relationship between me and Mike. You know, it’s like, Mike, and I haven’t had a one on one conversation in like, six years, you know, and it’s like, we used to meet, you know, once a month, or once every two months. And we used to have some very interesting discussions, because, you know, we might disagree about a lot of stuff, but we can have like an intelligent, you know, discussion about universal health care or things like that. But for whatever reason. Anyway, so yes, I believe trust is important. I want to be able to trust people. And if I can, if I can compartmentalize everything that happened with the whole recording thing, and just push it aside, try to say, okay, to people based on mistakes that might help people acknowledged or owned up to any of their mistakes. But even you know, maybe that’s like, to me, I can set that aside, just so we can just move forward and focus on other aspects of healthcare. So anyways, I don’t know if that was helpful. But there’s some feedback from me. Thank you.
Consultant Karma B 1:58:40
I think I think it is helpful. And I think I can acknowledge that it is unfortunate that this has been an issue that has been unresolved for you for seven years. And I think there is a strong desire to get you to a place where you do feel as though you can trust. And I wonder, is it something where I mean, you said perhaps I can. My invitation to you, Matt, in the same way as my invitation to Mari with the 10% Less is that I think it would be helpful if you could set this aside and look at the other things, because I do think that it is creating difficulties through the board. And I’m not sure that you will ever get the satisfaction of what happened in the past because that’s where I don’t have an eye speaking to your colleagues, not to us specifically, Matt. I don’t have a magic wand. I can’t change what happened in the past and I can’t I actually can’t change anything, right? You all get to decide. But I think I think Matt, that you need to stop bringing this up. up, in order for the group to move forward, in the same way that people need to stop throwing little barbs at each other, focusing on what was written in the past in the newspaper or quoted in the newspaper, what kind of campaigns people ran. So I think that there’s an opportunity, but it’s a choice, right? We can keep talking about what happened in the past. And you can be each one of you, each one of you can be right. And I’ll just give it to you right now, each one of you is right. You have legitimate concerns, there is strong evidence for your point of view to support exactly what you feel. And I am not arguing that in the least. What I’m inviting you to consider is that if you would like to focus on the community’s health, and the hospital, and how we make sure care is amazing. And this beautiful new addition, is pulled off effectively, and that each one of you feels like you leave a legacy behind. When you are no longer on this board, then the opportunity is to step up and shake it off. Again, with with great respect and admiration. I’m not in your shoes. I’m not trying to do what you’re doing. I truly say that I mean that honestly, I would not run for election on a public board. Because I’m not sure I would be very good sitting in the seats that you’re sitting in. And I live in a district that could run for board. There’s one just down the street. So Matt, I’m looking at your colleagues as well. But I just said a lot. Anything else you’d like to add there? Or should we talk? Have them chime in? Good for the moment. Okay. Others joke that.
Commissioner Buhler Rienstra 2:02:19
There, there has been a lot of tension between us. I respect your opinion. I, I believe that we could go about, you know, we could have gone back about this in a different way. But I want to assure you something, Matt, what I did, as chair. And what I did as a as your colleague on the board, was always to protect the interest of the organization, it was never to prevent you from doing what you want it to do. And I’m not going to go into all the details that we’ve gone over and over for so long. You know them, I know that the rest of the board knows them. But I will say that if you think that any anything. I rephrase this whatever you think that I did against you, please. It was not it was not against Matt ready. It was to prevent it was in my best judgment as as chair and as a board member to protect the district with the with the archiving of the documents and anything that I did that made you feel otherwise. I apologize for including the the letter. So I hereby apologize for not getting that to you earlier. I I obviously misjudged your reaction to that. And please, can we go along from there, you’ll accept my apology
Commissioner Ready 2:04:21
I accept your apology.
Commissioner Buhler Rienstra 2:04:24
All right. Thank you. And I sincere
Commissioner Kolff 2:04:31
And I’d like to say Matt that I also could have done more to support your passionate concern for having our meetings be accessible to the public. And so I apologize for not doing that because in my heart I share your interest Last year in making our actions, transparent to the public, and just four out of laziness and expediency, I didn’t stand up and and say what you continue to say. So I, I apologize for not backing you up more
Commissioner Ready 2:05:37
thank you
Consultant Karma B 2:05:43
thank you, I think the the opportunity remains for all of the board and Mike is your CEO, to continue to move in the direction of stepping up and shaking it off. And I turned and turned 50 and 2020. And you get older, right? And you reflect on things and, and I always thought when I was younger, that life had an arc to it. And that things came up and challenges presented themselves and eventually, there was resolution, right, there was resolution and maybe not a bow but maybe a bow you got to put a bow on things you got closure, you got and and I grew up in a house where there was a real, we are going to have closure, we are going to talk about this until you are so beaten down that you will admit to closure whether you want closure or not. So I didn’t have good modeling of how life actually is. And I think that what I reflect on in this conversation with with each of you, in your heartfelt comments, talking about how you feel as though there is not a completeness to the things that have happened in the past. And if you would only have a completeness, you would be able to go forward and and what I would you know what I reflect on and again, not to not to try to get in anybody’s head or or say that I understand life at all. But if you were to consider the idea that you will never complete that it is not possible to go and get closure on those some of those things. And I do I do apologize, and if I but that’s where we can’t change what happened in the past. And, and we and you may think there are things people could do now, that would make them make you feel more like you could you know, kind of move forward. And I’m not this is not just about Matt, right? Because when we did the interviews, every single one of you we’re talking about things that other people did in the past. And it wasn’t just about now. You know, it wasn’t you. And so there is going to it’s going to be an imperfect process because you are all imperfect. And I’m very imperfect. And we’re all people, right? We’re do and again, hello COVID. We’ve just been through really, really hard times, hard times personally, we’ve lost people we’ve loved hard times professionally, really hard times It’s an organization that community is suffering. And so if we could acknowledge that each one of us comes to this table as a flawed, possibly very flawed human being who has been doing the best they can and recommit to that going forward. that I think will will help. The other thing that you all have on your shoulders, which most boards that I work with don’t have on their shoulders, is this responsibility, that you are a publicly elected individual who regardless of what happens in Washington DC, is held up to a higher standard than other members of your community. There are things expected of you in terms of how you show up and how you interact, that are beyond what is often expected of somebody that we run into in the in the grocery store. You know, we’re people we watch on the street corner interacting, and it’s not it’s not fair and it’s probably not entirely possible in all cases. But I want to invite you to that higher that higher level on behalf of the community and getting back to that slide earlier about the you know, the what the how it all kind of flows down hill or, or you know what you do as a board and being that people log in or show up or listening to what you’re doing. They’re there. They’re watching for signals about what this organization is at its core, based on how this organization interacts at its most highest leadership table. And so I’m not trying to castigate anybody at all. But you know, we. So let’s, let’s try to view that that first sentence of the mission to hold trust and improve the health of our community through compassionate care innovation there medical excellence, that I think we can do.
Commissioner Kolff 2:10:45
So getting back to this specific, I’d have one thought, or question. Is it month of responsibility of the board to decide whether or not we record our meetings or not? That’s not a CEO decision. And if that’s true, then it’s the board that we should be struggling with in terms of building trust around this. And it shouldn’t be Mike, who, quote gets the blame by any of us for the mistakes that we made in the past? Regarding the recording?
Consultant Karma B 2:11:26
Well, I think the should not should,
Commissioner Kolff 2:11:29
perhaps not sure. I shouldn’t say I shouldn’t. But this this model board issue, and not a CEO issue,
Consultant Karma B 2:11:40
what we’re talking about right now has nothing to do with recording meetings, in my opinion. Yes, that was sort of the the, that was the grain of sand started to form that URL. We’re talking about the URL now. And I don’t I don’t know about you, but I am so weary of talking about whether you record your meetings or not. I don’t, I don’t see the times. And whatever the relationship is between your CEO and one of the other Commissioners, they’ll have to work that out. So I don’t think that’s a board issue, either. So I don’t want to continue to talk about I mean, my suggestion, I don’t think we should talk about that. Or I don’t think there’s anything we can do about that. And like, you know, to Mari you know, if you think other people aren’t getting enough air time. They’re grownups, they’ll get their own airtime. You know, exactly. So that, you know, you don’t think you can lay that burden down. It’s your character.
Commissioner Dressler 2:12:37
Yeah. Yeah. To a degree you’re carrying it. Because I want to hear other people’s opinions.
Consultant Karma B 2:12:43
Well, then you can ask them, you can turn to Bruce. And you could say he was well, pearls of wisdom. Yes. We’re
Commissioner Dressler 2:12:48
all separate. That’s why I think Bruce is correct. Yeah. But when we meet in public, you know, in person again, it will be beneficial to the board. Yeah. And I didn’t want to say something about Matt. I’ve known Matt, ever since I came to terms in health care about 25 years ago. What a kind. Sweet, we it’s not the right word, pleasant colleague, because I was working, nursing. And he was working in it at one particular thing that I always remember, in those days that math was he don’t tell big prints is something for me, because we didn’t have a computer at the time I paid for my son’s bedroom as a little graphic. And my son was about six or seven years old. It was very exciting. So that’s the sort of person that was then 25 odd years ago. And I think that person is still there. So I’m hoping that the relationship can earn friendships can improve. Particularly, I think we when we meet together in person, it will be a lot easier.
Consultant Karma B 2:14:04
Mike, I don’t again, you can choose. But you have been relatively silent. And yes, we’re talking about the commission. And yes, it is on them. But obviously, you’re a part of this group and this group dynamic. Is there anything you’d care to weigh in on here or point of view you’d like to share?
CEO Glenn 2:14:24
Well, I think a fundamental problem is the purpose of the letter. That is the purpose of the letter was me seeking legal advice. And me and I do that all the time, and I don’t buy practice forward. Advice from counsel on how to handle a situation to the commissioners but This was how do I deal with a commissioner choosing to record a meeting, prior to the board electing to record the meeting? Everything from can they do that to? Is it an open public? Rep. How do I deal with that? So the letter pose that the call posed that question and the letter answered it in, you know, paid by the word fashion, it was a, it was a three letter or three page letter. That that’s that said, here’s what you need to do you if a wreath a commissioner records a meeting, he is doing that in the capacity of a private individual who can who can record? So you need to figure out a way to to transfer that document to whatever archiving system you have. So so that that was the purpose of the letter. I mean, some sense that it’s this letter seems like a red herring, because it it was a how do I handle this situation? And, and frankly, I resented having the hafta. This is a this is one of this is one of us creating this, this operational challenge and legal and finally, putting us in legal and financial peril if we didn’t manage it correctly in the financial peril is the fine from violating the on public record act. So there was some resentment with that. And also this overarching it’s a commissioners get to decide if they want to record meetings or not. And and it felt just sort of like, well, here’s how I will. Matt was, here’s how I’ll just get this anyway, I’ll force the issue. So but that, but that that’s the purpose of the letter. And when I reflect upon, when, when I shared it, how I shared it, I certainly, I mean, it, it turned into how we operationalize it. Certainly, and I don’t recall if I, if I shared it promptly with Jill and Marie, I think I think they were on one of the calls when we were talking with Brad about what the hell do we do with this? And there was an element of, of protecting the district, which is, how do you deal with that protecting the district, from the actions of the district? So you want you want to talk about yes, there probably was the nexus of some lack of trust. That sound like was planted for both of us. But but then the, the, how we recall the letter is, is vastly different. You know, I don’t, it just was sort of this, here’s, here’s how you need to do this. And here are the people can record missionaries can record but here’s what you need to do. With with those recordings. So when I hear the letter I referenced in a different way than then I interpreted or used it as the basis for this ongoing thing. I think it’s important to one share my impression of the letter and what its purpose was, and kind of what it says. Because it does it sounds like that’s like that is that is this big issue. And that’s what that’s what makes me were reluctant to I use this this false. It’s setting this false premise of what occurred, then?
Consultant Karma B 2:19:14
Well, I think it’s a I think that perceptions can differ. And I think that opinions can differ, obviously, they do. And what I am hoping for all of you is that this can be laid to rest. And that any discussions going forward about recording meetings have to do with the meeting that you’re having or the meeting that you’re going to have in two weeks and how or whether or when or what you know, as opposed to what happened seven years ago and last year and so I wonder if we might call this issue complete. And you be if I may say are going to have to We’ll agree to disagree about what the letter meant and when it should have been shared and how you I mean, you know, and, and so, explaining, you’ve all explained your points of view to each other, I think until you’ve heard them multiple times. And so if there’s benefit in explaining any more points of view, now is the time to do it. And if anybody feels like they have more to say, I’d like to invite that now because my goal is at the end of this conversation, we declare this conversation and this issue complete. Again, everybody gets to choose. But if somebody else chooses to not make the conversation complete, do you want to then go with them? And let them pull that conversation there? Or do you want to say, thank you. Now, what’s the other business we’re talking about?
Commissioner Dressler 2:21:00
I just like to add something, if I may. And I think this might because my feelings about the issue was that I couldn’t believe that somebody who was on wanting to be in the position on the board, for the health and safety, safety and wellness of our community members would allow them to put the district in jeopardy. That’s how I saw it. Because there was no policy or anything, the board hadn’t decided one way or the other. And so it’s it’s right at the very beginning. And so I was just astounded that anybody got the desire and belief to to get elected, would then go and put the organization in jeopardy from financial issues. I mean, what I’m just kidding, I got fined over $100,000 for a lapse or being able to find something from the open public records. And they were asked for, so that was, I was just a standard. And that’s what bladed I think my, my say my view, but But it’s, it’s closer, which certainly between myself and
Consultant Karma B 2:22:19
Mr. Reddy. Okay. So thank you for that explanation. Bruce, and then case.
Commissioner McComas 2:22:24
So I haven’t commented about this issue, because I was late to the, to the issue, or things that happened in 2014 and 2016. That didn’t come on board until 2018. And Matt referenced something that I said and wanted to meet me instead, it was because by that time by 2021, when we revised our board, to stiffen up our policy around audio recording, I felt we’ve done what we needed to do. And then it was resolved in my mind, and but I hadn’t been part of all the rest of it. So so I’m sorry, mad if I offended you with what I said back then. But that was my perspective is that, you know, we dealt with it. We were because when I came on the board, we were recording the meetings, you know, and then we we made it even better policy in 2021.
Commissioner Kolff 2:23:21
Case, yeah, I was struck by with your comment about how you when you said, How could somebody put the your event you felt uncomfortable with somebody putting the organization at jeopardy? And I guess my question is, what if anyone feels that what I’m advocating for, will prevent the organization from being in jeopardy and that that’s so it’s a it’s really a subjective call, sometimes as to what is the best for the organization. And it’s, and it seems to me a very slippery slope, to begin to think that what I think is best for the organization is better than what you think is when we have a difference of opinion.
Commissioner Dressler 2:24:10
No, I think you misunderstood what I said. What I said was because there was no policy in place, the board had not decided, and it was prior to any policy being in place any decision by five member board. That’s what that’s the issue. Not me. I offer an observation. Sorry. I think we’re getting dragged back. Yes, we are.
Consultant Karma B 2:24:33
And so again, you will never have resolution in the sense that they won’t understand your point of view. I’m so sorry.
Commissioner Dressler 2:24:39
Well, I’m really sorry. Yeah, no, I really haven’t talked to our project. That’s alright with you. The big the big, because you think I tend to go by the rules, try and go by the rules so professional, and if I don’t believe that if you look around the communities Well, no Is the law and policy by disabled? Probably. But I think if they’re
Consultant Karma B 2:25:09
like, yes, because if there’s emotion happiness, but it is so old you all like, honestly, there’s so much you all are so, you know, bright and invested. And there’s so much interesting stuff to talk about. Please, let’s start talking about this.
Commissioner Kolff 2:25:28
I wasn’t talking about this particular incident, I was talking about the concept, which helps build trust and understanding. So that, so I’m happy to take this conversation. It’s
Commissioner Dressler 2:25:43
what I said, and what I said, You misunderstood.
Consultant Karma B 2:25:47
And so I invite you to sideline that conversation. And I’ll just, like, give you a little anecdote I have a cousin that every year at Christmas, her Christmas card is she’s kind of an interesting person and our Christmas cards a letter, and she puts glitter in it, or glitter, but those little like those little stars, you know, and so every year I have to open her a card over the trash can. And invariably, some of you get somewhere and I heard something someone said, and forgive me, this is crass. And maybe this isn’t totally appropriate. But glitter is like herpes of the craft world. It just keeps popping up. This is your glitter. This topic is like your glitter. It’s your kryptonite. You’re better than this. Let’s stop talking about this. And, and you know, I’m being somewhat glib, because you all know me. And so I’m taking, I’m taking liberties here. Is there anything anybody else would like to say? No, to be complete? Laurie, you don’t have anything else to say about this issue at this table. Okay, thank you, Mike. Anything else to say? Matt, a lot has been said since you weighed in. So I’m not. I’m not being facetious. Is there anything else you’d like to say to have closure here?
Commissioner Ready 2:27:19
No, I mean, it’s is nice to have a little bit of more information. But I don’t I mean, it’s like, it’s not like I couldn’t say things. I’m just I’m also really tired of it. And I’m trying to just sort of like see a path to on, I guess. I mean, it seems. Mike, it just seems you’re really sort of dismissing that opinion as a really irrelevant thing. And it’s very, just seems like when when we hired John French, I was like, so thrilled we have a lawyer, and I asked to meet with him, because I had, I talked to him about this, all these concerns about the recording issue, like years ago to try to get it resolved. And he said, “I will work on this. And I will figure this out. ” And I never heard from him again. I assume it’s because he went to talk to you, Mike, and you said, “No, don’t don’t work on this.” I have to assume that otherwise, I don’t know what what he was doing. And then I don’t know why it took so long. It just it just took so long to get to a point where everyone acknowledged you can’t stop a commissioner from recording the recording it. Basically, the legal opinion, that letter is what finally broke-uh ended it and it was it was really the only way we finally got a legal written legal opinion on the topic. And anyways, I mean, I think you’re just sort of like dismissing it just really holding back that legal opinion. It’s like,
Consultant Karma B 2:29:34
so Matt is is this…
Commissioner Ready 2:29:36
It could be considered fraud. It’s just not you know, it’s just like pointless fraud because fraud would involve some sort of financial benefit or something. But this was just, this was just sort of like a deception for, i dont know, for because people disagreed on something,
Consultant Karma B 2:29:55
Matt are you an att-, may I ask,are you an attorney
Commissioner Ready 2:30:01
Am I an attorney? No.
Consultant Karma B 2:30:03
No. Okay. So sticking to the areas that you are expert in, or I mean, really what what I’m invite what I’m asking is, again, I’m suggesting that you may never get complete satisfaction on this issue. And you and Mike are going to continue to disagree on the characterization and what it was and what it means and why it was done. Is that something you could possibly X except that you’ll have that difference of opinion? Or would you like to continue to have the commission spend its time on this conversation? It not just today, but like in the future?
Commissioner Ready 2:30:49
No, I think, actually, I guess just one thing. I mean, I, I mean, I’d like to know that the Commission will get legal answers when it needs legal answers. I just leave it like. That, in general, doesn’t have to be about this topic. But it’s like, it was so hard to get legal answers. I don’t feel like the commission has a way to necessarily reliably get legal answers. And so
Consultant Karma B 2:31:22
if I could turn to your chair, and I say, you know, will the commission get legal answers when it has needs legal answers? Chair?
Commissioner Buhler Rienstra 2:31:31
Yes. And it has.
Consultant Karma B 2:31:34
Well, that’s an opinion, the answer is for the future. So Matt, do you accept Jill’s comment that going forward? When the Commission needs legal answers, and we’ll get legal answers? Are you willing to extend that level of trust to the chair?
Commissioner Ready 2:31:52
I would like to. It does get colored by her immediate it has I mean, that’s the thing. Everyone’s like, that’s a will. And I’m always
Consultant Karma B 2:32:01
like, Matt, can’t we? You’re gonna this is where there’s no perfect, right? We’re all flawed individuals, are you willing to because it’s that idea that you have to extend it to get in. And if you can’t extend trust to your chair, that in the future, their legal answers will be forthcoming. When they’re needed. It’s going to continue to hamper that. I mean, you get to choose right, but you said you would like to, would you be willing to extend trust?
Commissioner Ready 2:32:35
Yeah, I mean, yeah. I mean, we got to, we have to be able to trust in that. And that’s why I had to say it out loud.
Consultant Karma B 2:32:45
Okay,
Commissioner Ready 2:32:46
I need to be able to trust the board to get legal answers.
Consultant Karma B 2:32:50
And do you now going forward?
Commissioner Ready 2:32:54
I’m hopeful.
Consultant Karma B 2:32:55
Okay, that’s maybe that’s enough. Do you want to keep bringing this topic of recording in the past with the commission? Is that a conversation you’d like to continue to have in the future?
Commissioner Ready 2:33:08
No.
Consultant Karma B 2:33:09
Can Can we consider this issue complete from your standpoint?
Commissioner Ready 2:33:17
I don’t know what you mean by that. But I’m not interested in talking to the board about it.
Consultant Karma B 2:33:24
Okay. Thank you. Are you are you? Are you interested in talking to others in the community about it publicly? That’s a question from your chair.
Commissioner Ready 2:33:42
I mean, I dont know what you mean by interested? I mean, it’s a it’s a topic I’ve been like talking about for like, eight years, because I’ve been trying to figure out so it’s, I mean, most of my people that know me and never want to hear me talk about it again. So no, no one. No one wants to hear me talk about this- I mean, outside the community. So I don’t think you have any worry about that. Nobody cares. Absolutely Noone cares about this issue except me, so even if i wanted to talk to people about it. No one’s listening.
Consultant Karma B 2:34:19
Are you? Do you do you need do you feel a need to write about it on your blog? That was the question that Jill was whispering.
Commissioner Ready 2:34:30
I’m not writing about it at the moment. I never know what I’m gonna write about in the future. But again, I might reflect on anything that happened in my life. I mean, there’s a lot of lessons I’ve learned from this episode. So it’s inevitable that it’s going to come up.
Consultant Karma B 2:34:48
Alright.
Commissioner Ready 2:34:48
but not necessarily on my commission blog.
Consultant Karma B 2:34:51
Okay. So everybody in this room has an opportunity to be complete with this issue and your completeness doesn’t, or I would suggest, you might choose to not make your completeness dependent on whether somebody else is complete, because then you hold each other hostage and let yourself be held hostage. And so if the issue comes up again, at the Commission table, you have an opportunity to say thank you, and go back to other business. Truly, it’s like a rabbit hole that has no bottom. And so if I just think everybody should feel, you know, to the degree you agree with me that if this comes up and you start talking about it, it will take precious time. And so, a conversation involves two people or more. So, I suggest we consider this one closed. I see nodding heads I’d like to go back to talking about the trust issue more broadly. And talk specifically about the board book. The board book talks about, you know, the the values that you articulate…
